Wednesday, April 15, 2009

"When I called again there was none of you to answer"

The Love Monster brought up a pertinent topic pertaining to the three watches doctrine and posted some questions and observations about it. This came about as he was studying section 133.

He points out a passage of scripture that is actually one of the best evidences of the three watch doctrine.

I felt that his observations and this topic was important enough to make a post out of. His comments and questions are in red and my responses are in black;

I am studying section 133. You said that 95% will take place in the third watch.

The end of the section leaves me feeling very disheartened. It ends on such a sour note.

That is exactly how I felt when I studied that section!

I take it the first watch is mentioned by the following,

"In that day when I came unto mine own, no man among you received me,
and you were driven out.

Yes, I believe that is correct!

Is this when Christ came to the Jews in the meridian of time? I take it that he didn't come to the Gentiles but to the jews who were "mine own"

The phrase “mine own” must be taken in context as it is used in different ways.

Yes, there is strong reason to believe that it is speaking about the Jews in the first watch in the passages you are referring to. However, I am not sure that is the case.

Most of the time the phrase does seems to refer to the Jews, who, as a group, will ultimately receive a terrestrial inheritance and will belong to and be visited by Christ who, according to section 76 does visit that kingdom while the Holy Ghost visits the telestial kingdom.

Here are a few typical uses of the phrase in the context that is probably being used in section 133;

D&C 10: 57

57 Behold, I am Jesus Christ, the aSon of God. I came unto mine own, and mine own breceived me not.

D&C 11: 29

29 I am the same who came unto mine own and mine own areceived me not;

D&C 39: 3

3 The same which came in the ameridian of time unto mine own, and mine own breceived me not;

There are times, however when the Lord refers to the elect as “mine own elect”;

D&C 35: 20, 25

20 And a commandment I give unto thee—that thou shalt awrite for him; and the bscriptures shall be given, even as they are in mine own bosom, to the salvation of mine own celect;

And then there is one of my favorite verses;

D&C 45: 8

8 I came unto mine own, and mine own areceived me not; but unto as many as received me gave I bpower to do many cmiracles, and to become the dsons of God; and even unto them that ebelieved on my name gave I power to obtain eternal flife.

That verse indicates to me that when the Lord refers to a people as his own, they probably shouldn’t take that much comfort in it! If those that were “his own” rejected him and those who were not “his own” were given power to obtain eternal life, what does that imply?… hmmm

It makes you wonder if to be “his own” is to continue to be ruled by him throughout the eternities while those that are given power to obtain eternal life are not classified as “his own” because according to the scriptures, those who submit to Celestial Law become Gods and become equal with him.

Before we go further in this great lesson outline that the Love Monster has provided to us, I have a confession to make.

The way I describe the three watch doctrine in this blog and the way it is depicted in the diagram at the top of the blog is probably not totally accurate. I described it the way I did for the sake of simplicity.

The truth of the matter is that the definition of a “watch” is not necessarily exactly synonymous with the definition of a “dispensation”.

Of course one problem that is encountered is that there are different definitions of “dispensation” even among LDS scholars. Here are four similar yet different definitions found on the internet;

1- A time when God gives truth to men on earth through his prophets.

2- A gospel dispensation is a period of time in which the Lord has at least one authorized servant on the earth who bears the keys of the holy priesthood.

3- A dispensation is power and authority to dispense the word of God, and to administer in all the ordinances thereof"

4- Whenever the Lord reveals the plan of salvation anew so that men do not have to rely solely upon prior dispensings from heaven of the same glories and wonders, it is called a dispensation of the gospel. This may or may not involve a restoration of keys and powers and priesthoods. It did when Jesus came to replace the Mosaic dispensation, for instance, but not when the dispensations of Enoch and Noah were ushered in.

The gospel was “dispensed” to multiple groups of people during a given period of time referred to as the 1st watch. The point of the matter is that while the Gospel was being dispensed during a specified period of time to the Jews, then to the Gentiles then to the Nephites and then possibly to another remnant of Israel, the Lord of the Vineyard and his servant visited the earth. That period of time during which the gospel was being dispensed to multiple groups, was called a watch. So a watch can incorporate multiple dispensations.

With that point made, let us continue with the comments from the Love Monster.

Then the second watch is mentioned,

"When I called again there was none of you to answer; yet my arm was not shortened at all that I could not redeem, neither my power to deliver. Behold, at my rebuke I dry up the sea. I make the rivers a wilderness; their fish stink, and die for thirst. I clothe the heavens with blackness, and make sackcloth their covering. And this shall ye have of my hand—ye shall lie down in sorrow. Behold, and lo, there are none to deliver you;
for ye obeyed not my voice when I called to you out of the heavens;
ye believed not my servants, and when they were sent unto you ye received them not. Therefore, they sealed up the testimony and bound up the law, and ye were delivered over unto darkness. These shall go away into outer darkness, where there is weeping, and wailing, and gnashing of teeth. Behold the Lord your God hath spoken it. Amen."

When he "called again" was the call issued unto "mine own" or was the call to the Gentiles. Does this call happen in the second or third watch?

I would say according to my reasoning that the call would come to the same people who rejected the call the first time, otherwise, why would he say "When I called again"?

I can see how you might deduct that. And of course, if that is true, then it supports my previous statements that the gospel went from the Gentiles known as the “Church of Christ” from about 1830 to 1836, to the literal descendants of the Jews (dispersed of Judah) as well as other branches (including the outcasts of Israel) which were being grafted in and necessitating the name change of the Church to “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints”. In other words, the literal remnants of the Jew from the 1st watch were also gathered into the 2nd watch.

Nevertheless, I suspect that those he was speaking about in section 133 in both watches were ALL of the ones that failed to hearken to his voice. All of those who chose the law of justice or the law of Judgment over the law of mercy.

Let me point out that if you focus on verses 65- 74 it sounds like everyone that the Lord “came” to in the first watch and “called” ro the second watch failed to respond.



If you begin the focus on what he is saying at verse 62, to those living in the 3rd watch, he declares that those who repent and become sanctified will be given eternal life.

Then in verse 63 he transitions to those who had previously failed to hearken to the voice of the Lord. The things he says in verses 63-74 are not being addressed to everyone in those previous watches, they only apply to those in the previous watches that had failed to hearken to the voice of the Lord!

Here is a great key that many people don’t comprehend when they read end times prophecy… EVERYONE RETURNS TO BE JUDGED IN THE DAY OF VISITATION! Those who were partial in the law and refused to live the law of mercy and to bring forth the fruits that flow from love, including taking care of the poor by consecrating, will lament as they realize the harvest is past and their soul is not saved!

Wo unto you arich men, that will not bgive your substance to the cpoor, for your driches will canker your souls; and this shall be your lamentation in the day of visitation, and of judgment, and of indignation: The eharvest is past, the summer is ended, and my soul is not saved! D&C 56: 16

It is very important to realize that no one from the 1st or 2nd watch was exalted. Those who fell under the law of mercy were allowed to enter into the rest of the Lord and were reserved for the season to come. All of the righteous from the previous two watches still needed to come back in the 3rd watch.

16 ¶ Then they that feared the Lord spake often one to another: and the Lord hearkened, and heard it, and a abook of bremembrance was written before him for them that feared the Lord, and that thought upon his name.

17 And they shall be amine, saith the Lord of hosts, in that day when I make up my JEWELS; and I will cspare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.

18 Then shall ye return, and adiscern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not.

According to the Prophet Malachi, a book of remembrance was kept of those that feared the Lord during the first two watches and they will become Jewels in the 3rd watch!

The Book of Mormon informs us that the covenant is not fulfilled until the 3rd watch hence the final redemption does not take place until the 3rd watch.

Notice how the Lord uses the term Jewels in the exact same way it is used in Malachi in modern revelation to assure the righteous among those who failed to redeem Zion that they would be redeemed in the 3rd watch;

1 Verily I say unto you, concerning your brethren who have been afflicted, and apersecuted, and bcast out from the land of their inheritance—

2 I, the Lord, have suffered the aaffliction to come upon them, wherewith they have been afflicted, in consequence of their btransgressions;

3 Yet I will own them, and they shall be mine in that day when I shall come to make up my jewels.

4 Therefore, they must needs be achastened and tried, even as bAbraham, who was commanded to offer up his only son.

5 For all those who will not aendure chastening, but bdeny me, cannot be sanctified.

6 Behold, I say unto you, there were jarrings, and acontentions, and benvyings, and cstrifes, and dlustful and covetous desires among them; therefore by these things they polluted their inheritances.

7 They were slow to ahearken unto the voice of the Lord their God; therefore, the Lord their God is slow to hearken unto their prayers, to answer them in the day of their trouble.

8 In the day of their peace they esteemed lightly my counsel; but, in the day of their atrouble, of necessity they bfeel after me.

9 Verily I say unto you, notwithstanding their sins, my bowels are filled with acompassion towards them. I will not utterly bcast them off; and in the day of cwrath I will remember mercy.

10 I have sworn, and the decree hath gone forth by a former commandment which I have given unto you, that I would let fall the asword of mine indignation in behalf of my people; and even as I have said, it shall come to pass.

11 Mine indignation is soon to be poured out without measure upon all nations; and this will I do when the cup of their iniquity is afull.

12 And in that day all who are found upon the awatch-tower, or in other words, all mine Israel, shall be saved.

Also, in the beginning of the section, there is a call that to send forth the elders,

"Send forth the elders of my church unto the nations which are afar off; unto the islands of the sea; send forth unto foreign lands; call upon all nations, first upon the Gentiles, and then upon the Jews. And behold, and lo, this shall be their cry, and the voice of the Lord unto all people: Go ye forth unto the land of Zion, that the borders of my people may be enlarged, and that her stakes may be strengthened, and that Zion may go forth unto the regions round about."

Was this call issued forth in the beginning of the second watch?


This call was not issued in the beginning of the second watch. Remember what I said, most of section 1 and 133 and many other revelations are literally referencing the 3rd watch.

The revelation was given in November of 1831! It was given about five years before the Gentiles broke the everlasting covenant and the gentile Saints never took the gospel to the nations of the world during those five years!

About six or seven years later, the gospel was taken to foreign land to begin gathering remnants of the dispersed of Judah and the outcasts of Israel but that did not fulfill what is being spoken about in 133 because 133 is talking about sending the FULNESS OF THE GOSPEL TO THE WHOLE WORLD!!!.

Joseph Smith was not sending the elders to the nations of the world in 1831!

He was not gathering people from one end of heaven to the other (verse 7)

He was not sending them to foreign lands or to the Islands of the Sea in 1831 to 1836 and after that, the covenant was broken and the church was renamed and relegated to the preparatory gospel!

You must pay strict attention to what is being said in the revelation.

In the 2nd watch he was not having people gather from all over the world to enlarge the borders of Zion because Zion had not even been redeemed yet, nor was it ever redeemed in the 2nd watch! (verses 8-9)

The cry did not go forth nor has it gone forth during the last 180 years to “Awake and Arise and go forth to meet the Bridegroom” (see verse 10)

The Lord has not yet commanded all believers to first come to America so that they can be divided and geographically separated with the portion from Judah being sent to the JerUSAlem part of the promise land and those of Israel mingled among the Gentiles sent to the Zion part of America (see verse 12-13)

The Lord had not yet sent forth the angel flying in the midst of heaven saying prepare ye the way of the Lord and make his paths straight! (see verse 17 and by the way, remember verse one of section 65 given in October of 1831? That verse is clearly a prayer written for the 3rd watch after the return of the angel that says “make straight the way of the Lord”! Yet verse 17 of section 133 which was given less than one month later is also declaring that the angel has already come, saying “prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight! Clearly, 133 is a 3rd watch revelation just like section 1 and section 65 and many other passages through out the D&C )

Need I say more? Virtually this entire revelation is written primarily to the Saints of the 3rd watch about the events of the 3rd watch.

Either the revelations that Joseph Smith brought forth are false and full of unfulfilled prophecies and promises OR they reference a future dispensation!

The Seer and the Spokesman could literally return to the earth and conduct the 3rd watch without receiving any other revelations because they have already received enough revelations pertaining to the 3rd watch to provide a blueprint of what is going to take place! In fact this might just happen!

It is very possible that Joseph the Seer will spend his time bringing forth the inspired version of the Bible and translating other ancient plates and not even bring forth any other modern revelations!!!! I am not making a predicting that this is what will happen, I am simply saying that once you begin to have your eyes open to the third watch and you begin seeing the parts of our existing revelations in the D&C that pertain to the 3rd watch instead of the 2nd, it will blow your mind how much information is given concerning the events of the 3rd watch!


Then latter in the section, it speaks of the "servants".

"And this gospel shall be preached unto every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people. And the servants of God shall go forth, saying with a loud voice: Fear God and give glory to him, for the hour of his judgment is come; And worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters— Calling upon the name of the Lord day and night, saying: O that thou wouldst rend the heavens, that thou wouldst come down, that the mountains might flow down at thy presence."

Are these servants the same as the elders previously mentioned, only now they are serving in the third watch?


Even though section 133 appears to end on a bit of a sour note, If we drill down far enough, there is great cause to rejoice because we find that;

a) There is a remnant in all three watches that comes forth in the first fruits of the first harvest, having lived the law of mercy and they are exalted after the covenant is finally fulfilled in the 3rd watch.

b) Even the remainder of spiritual Israel who fall under the demands of justice will ALL be saved in the terrestrial kingdom in the second harvest after the tribulation and refiners fire has purified them.


hell Raising Love Monster said...

I came across a pertinent scripture about "mine own". It is the JST Psalms 14.

PSALM 14: 1-7
The Psalmist rejoiced at the day of restoration. (compare Psalm 14: 1-7)
1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no man that hath seen God. Because he showeth himself not unto us, therefore there is no God.
Behold, they are corrupt; they have done abominable works, and none of them doeth good.
2 For the Lord looked down from heaven upon the children of men, and by his voice said unto his servant, Seek ye among the children of men, to see if there are any that do understand God. And he opened his mouth unto the Lord, and said, BEHOLD, ALL THESE WHO SAY THEY ARE THINE.
3 The Lord answered and said, They are all gone aside, they are together become filthy, thou canst behold none of them that are doing good, no, not one.
4 All they have for their teachers are workers of iniquity, and there is no knowledge in them. They are they who eat up my people. They eat bread and call not upon the Lord [because they say, “there is no God” and "he showeth himself not unto us"].
5 They are in great fear, for God dwells in the generation of the righteous. He is the counsel of the poor, because they are ashamed of the wicked, and flee unto the Lord, for their refuge.
6 They are ashamed of the counsel of the poor because the Lord is his refuge.
7 Oh that Zion were established out of heaven, the salvation of Israel. O Lord, when wilt thou establish Zion? When the Lord bringeth back the captivity of his people, Jacob shall rejoice, Israel shall be glad."

I was doing a word search of the phrase, "none that doeth good". What a find!

I was curious to see what I could find that would coinside with the phrase found in Section 35

"And there are none that doeth good except those who are ready to receive the fulness of my gospel,
which I have sent forth unto this generation. Wherefore, I call upon the weak things of the world, those who are unlearned and despised, to thrash the nations by the power of my Spirit; And their arm shall be my arm, and I will be their shield and their buckler; and I will gird up their loins, and they shall fight manfully for me; and their enemies shall be under their feet; and I will let fall the sword in their behalf, and by the fire of mine indignation will I preserve them. And the poor and the meek shall have the gospel preached unto them, and they shall be looking forth [watching] for the time of my coming,"

I thought you would appreciate the find.

Love Monster

Someone who is watching said...

That is a great find!

Another fun search is "called by my name"

2 Chr. 7: 14
14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Jer. 25: 29
29 For, lo, I begin to bring evil on the city which is called by my name, and should ye be utterly unpunished? Ye shall not be unpunished: for I will call for a sword upon all the inhabitants of the earth, saith the Lord of hosts.